Vent Breather Help

[billman]

Looks like the vent breather in the 40 gal ex tank is sticking/not working. Anyone have this problem? If so how do you fix it? Knowing how it works/whats inside may help.


How do I know you ask? Read my other post "Free Laugh At My Expense".
If the tank is full or near full and parked on an incline, the oil finds its way up the fill tube and makes a nice mess on the door jam and running board.

Any help appreciated

[2000XLIFTED]

When I put my tank in it looked like a small white ball in the top of the vent. I guess it would float up if there is oil coming out and seal off the vent. maybe the ball is stuck down so oil can pass? have fun!

[billman]

Thanks. Now I just need to figure out how to fix the situation. I used to be able to fill the tank to the top since putting in a vent tube mod (3' of 1" vinyl tube looped up to a higher area with a mr gasket crome valve cover breather). Now, I'm guessing with the cold weather, the oil must really expand to force it out the fill cap. OR The vent breather is not functioning as it was in the fall. Still looking for ideas.

[Marv]

Russel, is this ball check valve built into the tank?

I was hunting for something like this for my 60 gallon toolbox style tank, but didn't have any luck finding one. I was hoping to use it to prevent my vent hose from leaking oil everywhere when the tank is completely full.

[2000XLIFTED]

Russel, is this ball check valve built into the tank?

I was hunting for something like this for my 60 gallon toolbox style tank, but didn't have any luck finding one. I was hoping to use it to prevent my vent hose from leaking oil everywhere when the tank is completely full.

Yep, it's welded in the top. Came that way from RDS. It's like a 3/4 I.D. aluminum tube with plastic ball inside. sorry no pics its waaaay up under the truck now.

[Marv]

Hmm....interesting. I've never really looked close on mine, but I don't think the toolbox style tanks have them. Would be nice if they did though. Maybe I could make one up myself...

Thanks!

[billman]

It looks like if the tank is full and I park on an incline the ball would seal off the vent, now making my filler tube the only way out during expansion.

[Marv]

It looks like if the tank is full and I park on an incline the ball would seal off the vent, now making my filler tube the only way out during expansion.

Yeah, I agree, that's what is happening. Which is probably what would happen to mine if I put the check valve on my tank too. Never considered it coming back out the fill tube.

But, mine is rarely parked on an incline for an extended period of time, so I'd hope that I wouldn't have to many problems with the fill tube.

[Jack_Toepfer]

Hmm....interesting. I've never really looked close on mine, but I don't think the toolbox style tanks have them. Would be nice if they did though. Maybe I could make one up myself...

Thanks!

I'm pretty sure mine has one. You should have a couple things sticking out of the top of the tank:
1. Fuel Level Sender
2. Coolant Feed
3. Coolant Return
4. Fuel Feed
5. Fuel Return
6. Vented Breather
7. Filler

[Marv]

I'm pretty sure mine has one. You should have a couple things sticking out of the top of the tank:
1. Fuel Level Sender
2. Coolant Feed
3. Coolant Return
4. Fuel Feed
5. Fuel Return
6. Vented Breather
7. Filler

Jack, sounds like we have the same connections for sure. I'm just not sure what all is in the breather assembly. Looks like on mine, I just have a standard 90 degree elbow with NPT on one end and a hose barb on the other. I could be wrong though, cause to be honest, I never took it out and looked at it. I'll have to inspect it a bit closer. Maybe it's a check valve or something that is just down in the tank.

[Jack_Toepfer]

Jack, sounds like we have the same connections for sure. I'm just not sure what all is in the breather assembly. Looks like on mine, I just have a standard 90 degree elbow with NPT on one end and a hose barb on the other. I could be wrong though, cause to be honest, I never took it out and looked at it. I'll have to inspect it a bit closer. Maybe it's a check valve or something that is just down in the tank.

Pull the hose off of it and suck on it. Nothing should come out. Only in. If it is a check valve that is.

[fiveohpatrol]

Now, I'm guessing with the cold weather, the oil must really expand to force it out the fill cap. as.

I just did some searching on thermal expansion of vegetable oil and the only coefficient I could find was for mineral oil. Now I know it's not exact, but will give us a rough idea. Lets say you start with 40 gallons, and it is heated from room temp 68*F to 180*F, using the coefficient for mineral oil yields a final volume of 41.6 gallons. Now drop that initial temp to 32 and it goes up to 42.1 gallons.
Either way, there's quite a bit of volume added when it's warm. If you fill your tank to the brim, you'll likely get some spilling out of the vent (although the ball SHOULD stop it).

[Marv]

Pull the hose off of it and suck on it. Nothing should come out. Only in. If it is a check valve that is.

Otherwise, I get a mouthfull of grease right?!?!? Lol...

I'm sure you guys would get a kick out of that!

[Marv]

I just did some searching on thermal expansion of vegetable oil and the only coefficient I could find was for mineral oil. Now I know it's not exact, but will give us a rough idea. Lets say you start with 40 gallons, and it is heated from room temp 68*F to 180*F, using the coefficient for mineral oil yields a final volume of 41.6 gallons. Now drop that initial temp to 32 and it goes up to 42.1 gallons.
Either way, there's quite a bit of volume added when it's warm. If you fill your tank to the brim, you'll likely get some spilling out of the vent (although the ball SHOULD stop it).

More good info Drew, thanks!

2 gallons is pretty considerable when you're talking about oil going everywhere you don't want it. I knew it'd expand when heated, just didn't know how much. I've only filled mine up completely one time and I'd bet that attributed to a lot of what I lost out the hose.

I'd almost bet mine just has the regular elbow and no check valve. Maybe Jason or James can chime in and clarify which ones had them and which ones did not.

[billman]

I just did some searching on thermal expansion of vegetable oil and the only coefficient I could find was for mineral oil. Now I know it's not exact, but will give us a rough idea. Lets say you start with 40 gallons, and it is heated from room temp 68*F to 180*F, using the coefficient for mineral oil yields a final volume of 41.6 gallons. Now drop that initial temp to 32 and it goes up to 42.1 gallons.
Either way, there's quite a bit of volume added when it's warm. If you fill your tank to the brim, you'll likely get some spilling out of the vent (although the ball SHOULD stop it).

Looks like this may be my problem. I'm sure the whole tank of vo is not getting to 180 but I am also guessing that the pocket of air that is trapped in the front of the tank when parked on an incline is also warming and creating a bit of air pressure to help push the oil out.