Will this work?

[Jack_Toepfer]

hehe... I was referring to skyski... being in the oil/fuel biz... not so much in the "sell the product" biz like Crawford. Same difference though... they both know more about it than me.

[Clay]

I stated that the heads heat the diesel, thats a fact. I absolutely agree. BUT the heads are heating ambient temperature diesel, potentially raising the temperature another 40-80*, I can't argue that, I have no idea how long fuel is in the heads... but 80+80 is 160... which, at the injector, is not a huge concern to me, again, not based on any facts, just that 160 is not super heated.

Take that same diesel, make it 160 before it makes it to the head (because you heated it in the tank, the manifold and the filter...). Now the diesel is 240... at which point its lubricity is severely decreased (fact?). 1% solution of hot WVO isn't very comforting to me, especially since this guy doesn't have any WVO... which is how this discussion started.

Am I worried that my truck will blow up because my heated diesel has now become as flammable as unleaded gasoline? No. But I do need to be aware of it. So do the people who may be around my truck that assume it is a tool box in my bed, and not a potential diesel bomb.

Just food for thought... forum has been pretty active on this topic and I think everyone has something to learn from it. When it comes to fuel, I don't think I trust anyone more than Jason though... it is his biz afterall. Heck, Clay, it may be yours too... I don't know.

1% mix of oil and diesel is much greater than 500 ppm sulfer the old lsd was...plenty of lube

No, its not my business but it is Jason Crawfords and I trust him over most all others I read from. His system is designed so that you can use diesel in the V3 and he will tell you that.
Oh, and the OP can use 2 stroke oil as lube in the diesel if he has no oil...also oil can be bought new at the grocery store cheaper than 2 stroke

I'm worn out now and its quittin time and

[Jack_Toepfer]

Snip...

I stated that the heads heat the diesel, thats a fact. I absolutely agree. BUT the heads are heating ambient temperature diesel, potentially raising the temperature another 40-80*, I can't argue that, I have no idea how long fuel is in the heads... but 80+80 is 160... which, at the injector, is not a huge concern to me, again, not based on any facts, just that 160 is not super heated.

Take that same diesel, make it 160 before it makes it to the head (because you heated it in the tank, the manifold and the filter...). Now the diesel is 240... at which point its lubricity is severely decreased (fact?). 1% solution of hot WVO isn't very comforting to me, especially since this guy doesn't have any WVO... which is how this discussion started.

Am I worried that my truck will blow up because my heated diesel has now become as flammable as unleaded gasoline? No. But I do need to be aware of it. So do the people who may be around my truck that assume it is a tool box in my bed, and not a potential diesel bomb.

Just food for thought... forum has been pretty active on this topic and I think everyone has something to learn from it. When it comes to fuel, I don't think I trust anyone more than Jason though... it is his biz afterall. Heck, Clay, it may be yours too... I don't know.

[Clay]

There is a difference between heated diesel and hot diesel.

Stock trucks have a very small heater in the fuel bowl which merely keeps the fuel from freezing. There is absolutely no attempt to make the fuel hot in the Ford system as the fuel getting heated by the heads is a byproduct of the head design and not meant to heat it necessarily. The V3 on the other hand, is designed to get (much thicker) vegetable oil hot, very hot even before it reaches the heads.

I'm sure there are a dozen guys with the kit that have run heated diesel with no problems... there are also guy who are so concerned with the lubricity of USLD D2 that they add 2 stroke oil to their stock tanks. There are always 2 camps on damn near every subject.

I guess we can agree that heating diesel isn't the best thing for the truck, but that the amount of heat added to it through a heated tank and hot V3 manifold do not effect performance and are not necessarily harmful. There will always be a lot of theory surrounding our trucks on oil, but the properties of D2 (heated or not) are well documented.

We could always keep doing this though, it is entertaining and educational.

Remeber the final HE for the V3 system that Ford provided for us? The fuel rails cast inside the heads? The diesel feeds through these heads also.
This time of year it would be easy to imagine your fuel is 80* to begine with in the stock tank and when reaching the heads, will easily be boosted...i don't know.... 40*....60*....80*? meaning your diesel is being heated before the injectors.

As far as lubricicity, If i went and pumped my VO tank empty, there would remain at least a half gal. of VO...agreed? and then i put 60 gal of diesel in it. That ration is neaerly a 1% mixture of VO to deisel. I believe this is enough to make the injectors happy. Maybe add another gal. of VO if you want more lubricicity.
I add a quart of VO to every tank of Diesel in my wife unconverted jeep for this exact reason.
Heres my opinion on the issue of Flammable vapor: These tanks are designed to be used with flammable fuels including unleaded I believe. Unleaded is flammable at the temps. that we operate in every day. The tanks are sealed but vented. Any vapor that comes from the vent will be minimal at best and will not be ignightable with any wind or breeze present.
You can fill a bucket to the top with unleaded and toss a match in it and 9 of 10 times it will not ignite. But fill the bucket halfway full and toss a match in it and the top half of the bucket is nothing but vapors and will ignite every time. Point being, the vapors must be concentrated and not able to drift away.
Any ignition source obviously is a bad idea also. We practice not getting near fuel pumps or other flamable areas with say a cigerette or other flame. The same is true with the tanks in our trucks. So we have no concentration of vapors from these tanks and we have no ignition source.
This is all why i wouldn't worry about putting straight diesel in my heated tank. I'v also never had a reason to do so and therefore haven't.
If you want to temprarily bypass the heat exchanger in the tank, get a 3/4" barb to barb, unclamp both hoses from the tank and connect together with the barb...the diesel will still get heated at the manifold but no explosive vapors will be able to escape at that point anyway.

[skyskijason]

i know...

The OE system does not heat the diesel that much, and not under all conditions (particularly hwy driving).

The fuel bowl heater only comes on when needed - very rarely...

The RDS tanks are made for VO tanks - as specified by DFA. There are fuel tank heaters out there, but i doubt you'll find one operating in lower 48 - especially in summer.

I greatly respect Jason C's expertise and opinion, but i dont agree on this subject. It wouldnt be the first time i was wrong, and i'm never to proud to say i when I was wrong. I will gladly change my opinion when presented with compelling evidence. Meanwhile i shut up now...

[Jack_Toepfer]

There is a difference between heated diesel and hot diesel.

Stock trucks have a very small heater in the fuel bowl which merely keeps the fuel from freezing. There is absolutely no attempt to make the fuel hot in the Ford system as the fuel getting heated by the heads is a byproduct of the head design and not meant to heat it necessarily. The V3 on the other hand, is designed to get (much thicker) vegetable oil hot, very hot even before it reaches the heads.

I'm sure there are a dozen guys with the kit that have run heated diesel with no problems... there are also guy who are so concerned with the lubricity of USLD D2 that they add 2 stroke oil to their stock tanks. There are always 2 camps on damn near every subject.

I guess we can agree that heating diesel isn't the best thing for the truck, but that the amount of heat added to it through a heated tank and hot V3 manifold do not effect performance and are not necessarily harmful. There will always be a lot of theory surrounding our trucks on oil, but the properties of D2 (heated or not) are well documented.

We could always keep doing this though, it is entertaining and educational.

[Tampa450]

Everyone is so scared of hot diesel....

Ive run a lot of it through my v3.

1. When I first bought my V3 I asked Jason C about this very thing... He told me not to worry about it, he does it all the time in his truck.

2. Like Clay said... diesel is hot by the time it hits the injectors on a 100% OEM setup. (Im sure #2 through the V3 is hotter, but...)

3. Everytime Ive added diesel, there is always those 5 or so gallons of WVO in the tank that the pickup cant get. It mixes with the diesel and adds lubricity, right?
It would prolly take 2 or 3 full tanks of pure D2 to get ALL the WVO out of the fuel in that back tank I would think.

4. The RDS tanks we have are actually designed for heating diesel fuel in extremely cold environments. Seems like if hot diesel ruined everything you ran it through, they wouldnt make tanks to heat it?

[Clay]

Really? With all due respect, what about the significantly reduced lubricity of hot diesel?

The diesel gets heated with the OEM fuel system design.

[skyskijason]

I wouldn't worry about heating the diesel if it were me.
Put diesel in it and go.

Really? With all due respect, what about the significantly reduced lubricity of hot diesel? (compounded by the already reduced lubricity of ULSD!) Im quite sure the injectors wont like that!! Also, the reduced viscosity allows for MORE heating than WVO would... Then theres always the flashpoint issue, diesel's FP is 125-140*F. Iow's, the vapors are explosive at those temps - not to mention youd be boiling your (expensive) fuel off. Same reasons ya wouldnt heat RUG, albeit the danger is somewhat less.

Maybe its just that I work in petroluem industry and see the dangers a little differently. Id be happy to hear about anyone whos run heated diesel for any extended time...

I like to say choose wisely, or please post pics of the carnage! Its one thing to hear about someone screwing an engine up, but burning the house down is something all together diffrrent. I prefer to err on the side of caution - especially concerning safety.

[Clay]

I wouldn't worry about heating the diesel if it were me.
Put diesel in it and go.

[lancaster,pa]

Ok, So any body care to explain in lame mans terms? ..

I got One valve, And could not decide which hose I'm cutting off, I notice Two hoses running along the insulation .. One going to the V3 one going to the tank or From the tank

So If I understand correctly I only need to shut one off?
which hose is the one I want? Coming off the fan, or the T from the cab?

hopefully mine is setup the same as all you guys

Im assuming it comes hot, out of the "Fan T", to the V3, To the tank, Back to the cab?

Edit: By the way, The objective is to cut out all heat so I can run #2 in my WVO tank..

bamboo - With your objective being to completely cut heat to the V3 and the tank, you are going about it in the correct way. Installing a valve in one line will allow you to burn #2 in your system without heating it in the tank or in the V3 itself. You can still decide to do a bypass loop just for the tank later if you want. Once you have installed your single valve and are burning #2, I would also suggest that you pull the fuse on the heater jacket to keep from heating fuel in the filter.

What I'm writing below applies to the 7.3. If you have a different engine, it might be good to post that and have someone here verify that my info applies to that engine.

It doesn't matter which hose you cut to install your valve (my first choice would be the one going to the V3 from the right side of the engine, but if the one returning from the tank is more accessible, that would work too). However, make sure you are cutting into one of the hoses after the "T" that either goes to the V3 or is returning from the veg tank. You do not want to cut into any hose before the "T" or into the hoses going to the heater. Again, do not cut into a hose on the engine side of the "T" or into one of the hoses going to/from the heater core. - Patrick

[bamboo]

Ok, So any body care to explain in lame mans terms? ..

I got One valve, And could not decide which hose I'm cutting off, I notice Two hoses running along the insulation .. One going to the V3 one going to the tank or From the tank

So If I understand correctly I only need to shut one off?
which hose is the one I want? Coming off the fan, or the T from the cab?

hopefully mine is setup the same as all you guys

Im assuming it comes hot, out of the "Fan T", to the V3, To the tank, Back to the cab?

Edit: By the way, The objective is to cut out all heat so I can run #2 in my WVO tank..

[Jack_Toepfer]

We're all here for the greater good, and I know I don't express myself in the most affluent ways possible... but I'm certainly not here to ruffle feathers.

[Clay]

Its all good bro

[Jack_Toepfer]

Didn't mean to offend you, just wanted to make sure you knew why I made the comment. Didn't think my response was argumentative, I didn't take any offense to yours at all?