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  • ~~Another Pressure loss issues~~

    I think i am seeing what some of you guys have dealt with.

    Heres what i know
    pressure dropped with only 2500 ,miles on filter. Checked prescreen (first time ever) and it was clean, so i changed the Donaldson filter, no change so it wasn't the filter. Pressure drop was down to 65 - from the normal 78
    So i adjust the pressure up on the V3 to 78 again.

    And here are those results.
    Idle pressure - 78 psi
    Cruising speed on flat ground - 75 psi
    cruising up slight 3% grade - 65 psi
    Accelerating onto highway (not WOT but heavy acceleration) 60 psi
    Accelerating balls to the wall - 50 psi and the light flickers off and on.
    Thats over 25 psi of pressure drop from idle to WOT with a clean prefilter and Donaldson. I can't figure out what is going on here but it seems like what some of you other guys are dealing with, although you don't have the luxury of a pressure gage to see what the drop is in different situation. A slightly dirty filter will amplify this also

    I just started having this issue so what is different lately?
    The outside temp is all that is different. Is it possible the oil entering the V3 is not warme enough to flow well through the prescreen? My oil in the tank is cold mind you - about 35* overnight but the truck stays in the shop so its about 45-50* in there - and the heated tank takes a little while to really heat that 90 gallons of oil...i'm thinking i have inadiquate heat before the V3.
    My oil, although clean and water free is cloudy at 50* and has the consistancy of grandmas gravey. I could imagine this would cause slow flow through the prescreen if the oil isn't getting warmed enough prior to the screen.
    I think the only way to test this theory is to remove the prescreen and drive it cold again and see. I don't need the prescreen anyway really - i had absolutely no junk from tank build in the screen and i filter my oil well enough that it has never been a problem in the past to not have a prescreen.

    Thoughts?

  • #2
    I think you nailed it when explaining my situation here recently and as you mentioned I don't have the gauge to monitor it real time.

    Everything I would check would come up with the same results you're seeing - everything appeared fine, clean and in good working order, yet the system and the light would still not stay on.

    I think from what you've said, the viscosity of the oil is the primary culprit. 35 degrees is pretty cold for the oil. Particularly when you consider there is very little head pressure on the FASS other than what's in the line. Did you ever finish wrapping all your lines?

    Also, does your new oil sources have more animal fats in them? Are you using any PH oils that you know of?

    I haven't run mine in three weeks since I'm stocking up on oil, but I'm interested to see how it does when I do fire it back up in the much colder weather. It's been down into the upper 20s at night here lately, so it'll be a good test for it.

    Last night I filtered a batch of oil that had been sitting since I heated it last Saturday. Temp was still around 65-70 degrees in the heater, but I could tell the oil was much, much thicker. Pressure on the McMaster filter housing was up between 20-25 psi - normally when filtering at 80-90 degrees, it hovers around 12 psi. I was surprised it made that much difference. I can only imagine what it's like to pump oil at 35 degrees.

    Did you ever insulate your tank by the way? Thought you mentioned you might consider it.
    Greasin & Grinin
    Vegi oil powered since Aug 08
    2006 F-250 PSD - CC, Lariat, 4X4 - Vegistroke converted 1/27/13!!
    2008 F-250 PSD - CC, Lariat, 4X4 - Sold
    2005 F-250 PSD - CC, Lariat, 4X4 - Sold

    Comment


    • #3
      It has been in the 20s/30s here for the past week. My truck has been sitting outside and no issues. My tank is not insulated and I only have the standard line wrap from the V3 back. I haven't even plugged in the truck yet as I keep forgetting to dig out my timer everytime I go to the barn. Switchover has been a little longer but maybe only an extra mile or so as I haven't actually logged it yet. Hope you get it figured out Clay.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by HORSEMOVER View Post
        It has been in the 20s/30s here for the past week. My truck has been sitting outside and no issues. My tank is not insulated and I only have the standard line wrap from the V3 back. I haven't even plugged in the truck yet as I keep forgetting to dig out my timer everytime I go to the barn. Switchover has been a little longer but maybe only an extra mile or so as I haven't actually logged it yet. Hope you get it figured out Clay.
        Get on that timer Jamie, I've knocked a 1/2 mile off of my switchover by using it in the summer, and now because I let it idle for so long in the winter, I switched over in less than 2 miles this morning.

        I haven't noticed anything in my setup that has been a result of the 20-30* temps here. My truck is never parked inside. I have the wrap that came with the kit from the V3 back, and I always have at least 30 gallons of oil in the tank. This morning with a full tank there were no problems with heating the oil. The truck only idled for about 15 minutes this morning with the block heater running for about 4 hours.
        Vegistrokin since 08/23/08

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by CHenry View Post
          I think i am seeing what some of you guys have dealt with.

          Heres what i know
          pressure dropped with only 2500 ,miles on filter. Checked prescreen (first time ever) and it was clean, so i changed the Donaldson filter, no change so it wasn't the filter. Pressure drop was down to 65 - from the normal 78
          So i adjust the pressure up on the V3 to 78 again.

          And here are those results.
          Idle pressure - 78 psi
          Cruising speed on flat ground - 75 psi
          cruising up slight 3% grade - 65 psi
          Accelerating onto highway (not WOT but heavy acceleration) 60 psi
          Accelerating balls to the wall - 50 psi and the light flickers off and on.
          Thats over 25 psi of pressure drop from idle to WOT with a clean prefilter and Donaldson. I can't figure out what is going on here but it seems like what some of you other guys are dealing with, although you don't have the luxury of a pressure gage to see what the drop is in different situation. A slightly dirty filter will amplify this also

          I just started having this issue so what is different lately?
          The outside temp is all that is different. Is it possible the oil entering the V3 is not warme enough to flow well through the prescreen? My oil in the tank is cold mind you - about 35* overnight but the truck stays in the shop so its about 45-50* in there - and the heated tank takes a little while to really heat that 90 gallons of oil...i'm thinking i have inadiquate heat before the V3.
          My oil, although clean and water free is cloudy at 50* and has the consistancy of grandmas gravey. I could imagine this would cause slow flow through the prescreen if the oil isn't getting warmed enough prior to the screen.
          I think the only way to test this theory is to remove the prescreen and drive it cold again and see. I don't need the prescreen anyway really - i had absolutely no junk from tank build in the screen and i filter my oil well enough that it has never been a problem in the past to not have a prescreen.

          Thoughts?
          Clay,
          Seems like oil in the V3 (including oil passing through the pre-filter screen) should be hot enough that the viscosity would not be a problem even with some PHO in the mix (V3 really gets hot before the system will switch over). Makes me wonder if the viscosity problem is further back in the lines to the tank or in the tank itself. Seems like thicker oil in the lines or tank would decrease the pressure the pump can produce at the V3. I had a problem when temps dropped. I increased insulation on lines aft of V3 (first foam pipe wrap and then covered that with adhesive wrap that came with the kit) and insulated my tank. Also, I'm thinking that my small tank (17 gal) probably warms oil quicker than a larger tank by the time the system does switch to veg.

          Not presenting any of this as fact. Just what I have noticed and seems to be along the same line as other posts in this thread. - Patrick

          Comment


          • #6
            Clay,
            My pressure issues have been related to the pressure switch leaking around the housing? The leak get progressivly worst over time. Have you checked for a leak around the black housing on the pressure switch?

            I should receive a new pressure switch from Jason today that he has bench tested at 200* so lets hope it works.
            2000 F250 7.3L
            Vegistroke installed July 12, 2008

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by triplemoutdoors View Post
              Clay,
              My pressure issues have been related to the pressure switch leaking around the housing? The leak get progressivly worst over time. Have you checked for a leak around the black housing on the pressure switch?

              I should receive a new pressure switch from Jason today that he has bench tested at 200* so lets hope it works.
              Well i was under there adjusting pressure Sunday and no leak that i saw...it acts like i have a leak i mean over 25 psi drop at WOT? If there is a leak its more like a geiser. These V3s are made to pump alot of fuel with little pressure loss under throttle. I mean if it works well on Jasons, fuel guzzlin, on steroids, fire breathin behemoth, it should be no problem for my little ol 6.0 with stock injectors!

              Well i just got back from running around all morning...dentish and chiropractor - getting old is pure hell - and i have to say its not temperature related. It has warmed up nivcely today to be 70 degrees thus far and all the driving i did, my tank is hot to the touch yet i stomped on the skinny peddle once and saw my pressure drop like the Dow Jones. It went from 78 psi to BELOW 50 and the truck ran like poopoo by the way, like i was starving for fuel as the light flickered off and on.
              This sucks...I'm pulling the camper this weekend to go to deer camp and theres no way i'll be able to maintain any pressure with that load behind me. Good thing diesel is down, i'll be burning some.

              Comment


              • #8
                Clay have you tried blowing out the supply line or pulling/cleaning the pump yet?
                Greasin & Grinin
                Vegi oil powered since Aug 08
                2006 F-250 PSD - CC, Lariat, 4X4 - Vegistroke converted 1/27/13!!
                2008 F-250 PSD - CC, Lariat, 4X4 - Sold
                2005 F-250 PSD - CC, Lariat, 4X4 - Sold

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Marv View Post
                  Clay have you tried blowing out the supply line or pulling/cleaning the pump yet?
                  No, i'm waiting to hear from Jason...i thin khe knows more than hes telling right now.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by CHenry View Post
                    No, i'm waiting to hear from Jason...i thin khe knows more than hes telling right now.

                    Actually I don't know much. Usually just a lot of lucky guesses. :chuckles:

                    Given the symptoms you have described, I am not sure what to make of it. You are building good pressure, so no problem there. Since the V3 and the tank are in series, if the tank wasn't getting good coolant flow neither would the V3, and it simply would not turn on. I want to say it is a restriction of some kind prior to the pump. If I remember right, you used your old flexible pickup from the prior 90gn tank. Those typically have a screen on the end that can get plugged up. If you do have the flexible tygon pickup, take it out and have a look at the end. You may want to do this with the system on though so that if there is anything stuck to the end, it does not rinse off when pulling it out. So that is where I would start if i were you. (Oh yeah, If I were you I would invest all my money into DFA also)
                    1999 F-350 Lariat 7.3 385,000 miles and counting
                    2000 VW Jetta 2.0
                    1966 Jeep J-300 with EFI 351W

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Fordnut74 View Post
                      Actually I don't know much. Usually just a lot of lucky guesses. :chuckles:

                      Given the symptoms you have described, I am not sure what to make of it. You are building good pressure, so no problem there. Since the V3 and the tank are in series, if the tank wasn't getting good coolant flow neither would the V3, and it simply would not turn on. I want to say it is a restriction of some kind prior to the pump. If I remember right, you used your old flexible pickup from the prior 90gn tank. Those typically have a screen on the end that can get plugged up. If you do have the flexible tygon pickup, take it out and have a look at the end. You may want to do this with the system on though so that if there is anything stuck to the end, it does not rinse off when pulling it out. So that is where I would start if i were you. (Oh yeah, If I were you I would invest all my money into DFA also)
                      Your a funny boy Joe!

                      That screen has already been removed...upon instalation i removed it as it was already clogged from the inside - My return line was inadvertantly connected to that when you originally installed my V1...yes i had debris that it captured returning to my tank...remember those odd round cardboard looking punchouts that you and James found in my lines past the T to the heads? There was one of those and some other crap i could not identify.
                      So as you said, i have no idea why this is occuring or where else to look.

                      Today was another interesting drive in to work. 33 degrees this morning with a strong north wind blowing, truck was garaged overnight, V3 came on after 4-5 miles on the highway. Water temp on the commander readout was 183, i had to stop at a red light and after 20 seconds sitting there, the V3 turned off as if temp had fallen....stayed off untill i resumed highway driving and didn't go off again untill i turned it off in the parking lot at work. That was odd but i have witnessed this a few other times this winter. Winter hasn't really gotten ugly yet (yesturday we hit 80*) so it will be interesting to see what happens when it really gets cold and stays that way for seversl days straight.
                      Also this morning, no pressure loss while driving normal highway speed - 78 psi, idle - 78 psi, climbing small grades at 70 mph - 78 psi
                      WOT - 45 psi
                      WTF?!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Well another interesting developement in this "ongoing" saga. Did i mention i burned diesel fuel most of last winter because of the same problem? I had the V2 then and we deducted then that i had a coolant flow issue but i have since reinstalled the coolant hoses from the module back to the tank. The coolant hoses forward of the module are still original so i will check those for a problem next.
                        This is definately a coolant flow issue. Last night driving home it was a bit colder as was it all day while the truck sat in the refridge (parking lot at work)
                        When i was driving home, pressure never got about 65 psi and when i got home (32 miles of highway) I grabbed the hoses going to the tank...one was luke warm and the other was just a little hotter. Neither were hot enough to make me pul my hand back off. I could hold them all day and that tells me they were barely 100-110* Thats a problem.
                        Under the truck i have a hot collant hose going to the module and as i move back and feel the hoses, the heat drops off rapidly. Not from heat loss (hoses are wrapped) but from pour flow i assume. I am getting just enough heat to turn on the module but almost no heat back to the HOH or the tank. I'll check (again) the hoses from the engine back to the module and if i do not see a crimped line, i guess an aux. coolant pump is in my future.
                        I'm wondering if it could be related to the location we (jason) tired into the heater hoses but i really don't know much about that.

                        Jason?

                        Oh, and then on the way to work today... temps were 24* truck was garaged in the shop at 40* V3 came on in 5 miles and pressure was at 65 all the way into work...untill...almost to work and i smash the go peddle...pressure dropped to 25 This can't be right. V3 light flickered. I turned off the V3 and went to diesel and the pressure was low still...like 42. I got on it hard again and ...25 psi
                        So i think my pressure sender is taking a dump or something...got out and looked and no fuel leaking so WTF?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          It was 21* this morning and I was burning oil in about 2 miles.

                          Has anyone considered removing the T and just making the V3 a part of the coolant system? Instead of a T, just connect into 1 of the heater hoses, then return right back into the hose you cut. What could it hurt? Right now the flow is shared by the remainder of the cooling system, you could make all of the flow go through the V3 and the tank. Am I missing something?
                          Vegistrokin since 08/23/08

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Jack_Toepfer View Post
                            It was 21* this morning and I was burning oil in about 2 miles.

                            Has anyone considered removing the T and just making the V3 a part of the coolant system? Instead of a T, just connect into 1 of the heater hoses, then return right back into the hose you cut. What could it hurt? Right now the flow is shared by the remainder of the cooling system, you could make all of the flow go through the V3 and the tank. Am I missing something?
                            Jack,
                            When I did my install, I asked Jason the same question. He said that you have to be careful doing that because of the way it would impact on engine warming and use of the heater/defroster. If I remember correctly, he was saying that sucking all the heat out of the coolant to warm the V3 and veg in the tank would slow the increase in engine temp (better to have the veg system and engine warm together. - Patrick

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Thanks Patrick. That makes sense.
                              I think my truck is due for a water pump soon anyway.
                              Vegistrokin since 08/23/08

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